The UFO community keeps getting rocked by new information these days. Just recently, a series of leaked emails made it to the site Imgur. As of this writing, it’s had 845 views, so it’s fair to say the cat is out of the bag. Here is the link:
This is a series of emails from early 2001 primarily discussing Kit Green’s evaluation of the Santilli alien autopsy film (released in 1995 and shown on Fox TV in 1997). Although even by 2001 many commentators had already determined the film to be a hoax, Kit Green’s analysis said otherwise.
If you don’t know who Dr. Christopher “Kit” Green is, here is a decent page that can help. He is a scientist and former senior CIA intelligence officer with a longstanding connection to research into psi phenomena and UFOs. While at the CIA he was known as the “Keeper of the Weird.” He is a close friend to Dr. Hal Puthoff and, like Puthoff, probably knows as much about the UFO/ET situation as anyone out there.
This is an eleven-page leak, all emails dated from the early spring of 2001. The four participants were: Dr. Kit Green, Dr. Hal Puthoff, Dr. Eric Davis, and Dr. Colm Kelleher.
CC’d on the various emails were Robert Bigelow
John Alexander, Kristen B. Zimmerman, and an address noted only as “LNUSTC1.VZZ559@gmeds.com”.
These last two recipients are unknown to me. Other names are mentioned in the emails themselves, including Jacques Vallee at one point. This is clearly heavily connected to Bigelow, as Davis and Kelleher were both directly employed by Bigelow’s organization, the National Institute for Discovery Sciences (NIDS). Alexander, Puthoff, and Green also had strong connections to Bigelow, as most likely the other recipients in this small group.
Key points taken from these emails, which total 11 pages, is as follows.
Starting in the spring of 1999, Davis, Kelleher, Puthoff, and Green had many communications regarding the Roswell incident, alien bodies, the crash retrieval program, the Santilli film, and more.
During these communications, Green gave his opinion that the Santilli film was “real,” and that the cadaver depicted in it was not human.
The emails make it clear that Green received three different briefings on topics relevant to UFOs, Roswell, and alien bodies. These are described by Davis.
“Briefing #1: Official briefing at the Pentagon ca. 1981. While Kit was at the CIA, he was briefed on evidence that something (UFOs) was flying around, this evidence was in the form of collected intelligence data. (There was no discussion of alien crash retrieval hardware or bodies in this venue.) . . . .”
“Briefing #2: Unofficial briefing at the Pentagon ca. 1987/1988. After Kit left the CIA he was called into the Pentagon by a person in uniform. This person showed Kit the alien autopsy photos and reports, etc. The photos of the alien cadaver Kit saw were consistent with the cadaver seen in the 1995 Santilli film/video. Kit was asked to professionally evaluate the material provided to him at this particular briefing.”
“Briefing #3: Official briefing at CIA ca. 1991/92. While at General Motors, Kit was called into the CIA. The CIA people wanted his medical/forensic pathology expertise to examine and analyze some autopsy reports. The nature of these reports was left ambiguous during the briefing, but Kit was fully expecting them to be the alien autopsy reports he saw in Briefing #2. But then no action took place after this briefing occurred and Kit was left hanging.”
These were Kit Green’s three UFO/alien-related briefings. Two were described as official, one as unofficial.
Briefing #1 was an official briefing at the Pentagon and didn’t go farther than to mention that something like UFOs was real, based on “collected intelligence data,” whatever that might mean.
Briefing #2 was described as unofficial, and it’s the real bombshell. A full seven or eight years before the Santilli film appeared in 1995, Green was shown photos of an alien autopsy that was “consistent” with the being depicted in the Santilli film. Elsewhere in the email exchange, Green goes so far as to say it was the same being.
The description of Briefing #3 is not especially clear. We are not told what made this a UFO/alien-related briefing, although presumably something in this briefing must have made it clear to Kit Green.
Important note: I wrote earlier today to Kit Green about this. His reply in full was:
It was a hoax. This was almost 20 years ago. I learned about a decade ago who and why persons in the government lied to me.
You may quote me. I have zero additional comment.
To which I replied,
[I assume we] should assume the additional information regarding briefings in 1981, 1987/88, and the 1990s did take place?
. . . it’s hard to understand how identical images were shown to you in 1987/88 as what appeared nearly a decade later.
. . . I am just pointing out that these are obvious issues with the information already presented.
You are absolutely right: the short answer is I do not know. The much, much longer explanation is so complex I have no time in my busy medical practice to explain. It would take several days I do not have.
Cliff notes version: there are liars in the government, too.
I then replied:
Thank you for this additional comment. This would strongly imply that Santilli wasn’t acting on his own in creating whatever it is he created. It would imply he had help from the Pentagon doing it, with planning going back a full decade. From what I could gather regarding the CIA briefing from 91/92, it might imply they too were complicit, although that’s more of a stretch given the lack of information on that briefing. Yet it might be so.For the life of me, I have a hard time envisioning how and why that would have happened. Planning a UFO hoax for nearly a decade. Creating fake photos and fake autopsy reports good enough to deceive you — which could not have been easy in the least, and indeed a dangerous thing to attempt because they might easily be caught. Then (presumably) to give the film to Santilli. Since there is no way he is going to create out of whole cloth an exact replica of the alien body without intimate cooperation from the people who lied to you.. . . it seems a heck of a strange way to pull off a hoax. A long-con that failed almost as soon as it was released. Makes no sense to me — of course, I am a complete intel outsider.
The problem with the Santilli film is that there were many versions. [Santilli’s] angst was that when he realized that, he realized he had been used. I don’t think he was part of the later fraud; what I originally reviewed was a real autopsy, but it was one of the 17 progerics … several of which are very ‘humanoid’ looking through puberty.
He added that the scenario wasn’t all that complicated: a small group of government persons “seeking excuse for money” who used him for those purposes. And that the autopsy wasn’t of an alien, but one of “17 progerics,” that is, individuals with the disease progeria, which causes rapid premature aging.
I might add here that in my few communications over the years with Kit Green, I am not sure I have communicated with anyone who is as precise in his manner of communication, and few who are as formidable in their intellect. Kit Green isn’t just smart. He is very smart. It’s not hard to see why he gave science briefings to President Reagan.
His answers to my questions seem quite definitive. But I can’t help thinking that they leave several questions.
Green seems to be saying that his 1987/88 Pentagon briefing from a person in uniform was deliberately designed to fool him into thinking he was being shown photos of an alien autopsy and reports discussing the same. At this, we really have to stop and wonder. No one has seen these reports, and they surely would be interesting to read today. But Kit Green understands autopsy reports exceedingly well. Consider how hard it would be to fool him not only with photos but the report itself. I know that I couldn’t begin to do it. You would need someone every bit as knowledgable of medicine, biology, and hypothetical alien beings as Green is.
If it’s true that he was lied to, it would mean that Ray Santilli isn’t the primary author of his hoax, which is what we’ve been led to believe all these years. It would imply that the ground was being prepared many years earlier by the Pentagon, and possibly by the CIA (one way to interpret the 1991/92 briefing).
I know that we all realize that the military and intelligence community lie about things. But the magnitude of this would be significant. A decade-long preparation of an alien autopsy hoax by the Pentagon and CIA that is good enough to fool Kit Green but which quickly falls flat on its face once it is made public. Does this make any sense to you?
Beyond that, it would be well to ask why. The point of all this? Green implies money. I guess I don’t see how but okay, money by somehow creating a fake alien autopsy. Money would make sense if you only saw Santilli as the author of the hoax, although even the Wikipedia article on this repeat’s Santilli’s claim that he did see a genuine alien autopsy in the early 1990s and was trying to “restore” his film to match that.
But whatever Kit Green saw in 1987/88, and which was reinforced in 1991/92, was good enough, compelling enough, to make him believe. He was adamant that the Santilli alien was identical to what he saw in 1987/88.
Most of the rest of the email exchange discusses Green’s thoughts on the authenticity of various elements of what is depicted in the Santilli film. These are interesting and worth reading.
I keep wondering if something else is going on here. Perhaps the alien autopsy film is a fake, but not the fake we’ve been led to believe? Could it be a fake based on something true? And done with outside help?
Or – heresy – could it be real after all? Wouldn’t that be something.
After all, stories of alien autopsies were being discussed long before the Santilli film made its appearance in 1995.
I’m not offering a judgment one way or the other right now except to say that the scenario of the Pentagon lying to Kit Green in 1987/88 seems odd. I’m not saying it didn’t happen that way. I don’t know, but something smells wrong.
By the way, for those of you wondering if this leak constitutes the previously referred to “Big News,” the answer is … no! In my view, the Big News is significantly bigger than this.
I personally always thought that the alien in the film looked very real. I never really believed that this was a fake. It reminds me of the skinny Bob film. They both just seem too authentic. I imagine when these films made it to the world, the secret keepers went into overdrive. Why is this this nut so hard to crack. WTF. Keep at it Richard and Tracy. The only source of news that I trust and care about. Seems obvious to me that we’re not alone go look at the f*cking stars
Skinny Bob. That is the video of videos in my personal opinion. Richard, have you done any digging on the authenticity of that video? The fact that as far as I know there has never been a slam dunk debunk on that and the equally stupid fact that it apparently has never been shown on anything other than YouTube are both equally astonishing to me. Perhaps this would be a good video research topic?
Funny you ask. I am looking into that — will probably go deeper in a short while.
Hi Richard. I did a fair bit of some digging into Skinny Bob back when it first surfaced – particularly the South African transsexual /intelligency operative connection (memory is vague on details right now as it was 7 or 8 years ago, but one of the vids tagged a link to this) and published results on an internet forum, . Also added the insights that will follow below. Then received an anonymous basic coded message that when deciphered read along the lines of: “Those who watch from above see you. Curiosity killed the cat. Think very carefully before proceeding.” Prank message or something more? Don’t know, but unnerving nonetheless.
Remain unconvinced by anything I’ve seen then or since to suggest the core footage isn’t legit, and think the vids are just dressed up in a debunkable context, as Grant Cameron suggests is done with a lot of disclosure material to get it out and then pull it back. The timer at the bottom of the clip is deliberately out of sync and when you correct this, Bob’s movements suddenly become much more natural and compelling. I also found another clip on youtube of an alleged poltergeist incident where a woman is thrown up onto her bathroom ceiling by an invisible force, presented with the IDENTICAL opening text font and style as Skinny Bob. While the poltergeist vid seems fake, the presentation style of both is not just similar but identical to the point where there is no mistaking the same person produced both videos.
Am kicking myself that I can’t re-locate that vid right now, but will find it again and let you know, if interested, as I’m planning to produce a youtube vid summarising the research. More than happy for you to scoop me on it, if I can help you out. 90% sure it’s this footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juRjxZ_vc18 although the version here lacks the matching intro and outro font. The poltergeist victim’s name is ‘Paige’ which is probably the key to tracking down the matching version.
Gut feeling from research is that Skinny Bob, the Victor ‘alien interview’, Patterson Gimlin film and others (one out of left field is the Gable Film) are ALL following the same pattern of presenting core anomalous footage of genuine ‘aliens’ and cryptids in dubious formats for subsequent debunking once the imagery has been planted in the public subconscious.
If it’s OK, let me just tidy up and elaborate on what I said above about this ‘poltergeist’ video that I came across a few years ago, squeezing my memory to the limit without having actually re-located the right clip yet…
– Stumbled on it by accident on youtube during an unrelated search approx. 2014-2016
– Identical intro font on black background and identical fade in/fade out style as the Skinny Bob videos
– My immediate, unequivocal reaction upon seeing it was: ‘Goddamn, this is from the makers of the Skinny Bob videos! So they ARE fake!’ At that point I quickly and completely abandoned any further research into SB (after having already put it on the backburner for the past couple of years or so), utterly convinced that the same person had created the titles, and therefore the footage in both vids.
– I’m still 90% certain the poltergeist video in question is the one linked above (and again here: (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juRjxZ_vc18 ) though this is NOT the version of it with the identical font and style.
– The poltergeist vid is 100% fake, as it is part of a series called The Poltergeist Diaries available for sale on Amazon.
– In a final, half-hearted gesture, I remember cursorily looking into the uploader’s name – vonkoestler – to see if I could find any direct link with it and Skinny Bob, but to no avail.
I’ll keep searching because I really do think this is an important piece of the puzzle that, while not necessarily establishing Skinny Bob as a fake, almost certainly confirms that the ivan0135 upload (with its identical titles and editing style packaged around the core footage) is intimately connected to the poltergeist vid/vonkoestler channel.
Driving me nuts that I can’t find it again and I’m starting to fear it has since been deleted.
Wow that is completely mind blowing.
Richard, you probably know better than anyone here if there’s a chance Kit is telling the truth or not when he says that, in the end, it was just a hoax. It just seems weird that he’d go into so much details as to explain why he thought the footage was real, just to end up believing that it was in fact fake.
But also, asking him: “Do you really think it was real?”, now that the emails have been leaked, is putting pretty extreme pressure on him. It’s pretty much the equivalent of asking him to confirm, in his professional opinion, that the US government has in fact retrieved alien bodies. That’s A LOT of weight for one man’s shoulders! I would clearly understand that he’d lie at this point.
I wonder what you and other members think about that…!
Thanks for sharing!
Exactly, Domi. These are all good points.
My gut tells me that this whole “leak thing” is an attempt to distract the “top UFO researchers” from something that’s going on AT THIS VERY MOMENT…something that is of possibly much greater importance or value in the greater scheme of things. In other words, this has all the makings of an “Intel Op”…just my humble opinion.
Thanks for this Richard; the email string is an interesting exchange, no doubt; that intelligent and well connected people can be subject to a hoax or misinformation should be accepted as typical counter-intelligence practice – the goal is achieved, that is the hiding the truth, whatever that is, and/or diverting resources of our adversaries down unproductive paths.
I do find it interesting that with all the years of supposed government interest in UFO’s and paranormal it seems to be the same old names again and again, Green, Puthoff, Davies etc. Where are the other scientists, support staff, security personal, tradespeople, labourers and cleaners that must have had some insight into these hidden programs; there must have been thousands of people over the years. It must have been a life changing experience being exposed to the inner workings of a program dealing with Alien bodies and craft; it seems incongruous that there are so few reports, death bed or third party via family, when you consider the thousands of people that must have been involved.
The Davis/Wilson transcript is well and truly out; if this is the document you’ve been hinting at i’d appreciate your take on it’s authenticity. I’m particularly interested in how you think such a sensitive conversation, probably of the highest level of secrecy could be recorded, presumably either by machine recorder or short hand notes – how could Wilson have allowed this; it seems incredible that this conversation such as this could recorded in any way – and to be leaked?!
Is it about the Alien? Is it about discrediting the truth or people? Is it about planting a lie? Or trying to releasing some truth? I think it’s about beating the grass to startle the snakes. I think it is about seeing who talks to who, and who knows what?
I think Green is either collateral or targetted damage.
great summary. always appreciate your open and skeptical mind. can’t wait for the big news
I know the guy who made the Aliens, he’s from Brighton England. I can put him in touch with you if you wish.
My view is that the timing smells wrong. Why now. It doesn’t seem particularly controversial.
If it was being run as an Op (back then) the back burner narrative (outside of the public facing Santilli machinations) would surely have to be knowing that reading kit green in would likely end up involving, Bigelow, Davis, Kelleher and Puthof. Definitely a ‘ save for later’ scenario.
Who knows when you might need some future shade or doubt narrative cast on some or all of these individuals and related organisations In order to muddy the waters. Maybe like nearly 20 years later.👍
We ascribe many things to the CIA, some of which border on godlike powers. I would posit that the CIA’s ability to manufacture a film like the biopsy, would fall short of Hollywood’s expertise in CGI. Several CGI studios have commented on the Santilli film and stated that they wouldn’t be able to produce it. The film is a “period piece” and everything had to look like it was shot in the 1940s, on an old fashioned camera, in an impromptu fashion. To my untrained eye, it looks realistic and the head looks similar to someone with progeria, but not quite, IMHO. Google search progeria images and see if you agree?
I DO agree. that’s why Kit Green’s statement surprised me.
Thank you Richard!!
Here’s another leak related to Eric Davis- meeting notes of his from a meeting with Admiral Tom Wilson. You’ve already seen this document, as you have discussed on Fade To Black. The whole thing has leaked, in unredacted form: https://ufoscoop.com/
Here is the show. Segment around 2hrs 15min mark: https://youtu.be/AjDXDx7Qj78
Yes and this is the big news. I am writing a piece about it now.
Okay, so this *isn’t* the big news? Thank you for clarifying that point.
In the next weekly wrap or AMA, I’d love it if you could discuss what it was like for you when the Santilli film was made public, why it is considered a fake, and how this email exchange changes things. I remember watching at the time and hearing that it was a fake, but do not recall the details re: why.
In James Clavell’s book Shogun, the Japanese warlords often referred to their schemes as the creation of a “dream within a dream” – the illusion of reality. I wonder if the current deep state has the same thing in mind.
Thank you for posting this. It has been pretty well discussed here on “thoughts”. My own are that it was an operation Mocking Bird encase any information leaked on what was probably a real autopsy done around the Roswell crash period. Anything leak could be linked to the fake film. Dr. Green might have be a litmus test to see how well the cover-up worked.
Richard: Kristen Zimmerman had the email address of “LNUSTC1.VZZ559@gmeds.com”. The domain gmeds.com is linked to the General Motors Desert Proving Grounds in Yuma, AZ and is linked to Defense Systems Management and development of various types of land, air, and space vehicles. LNUSTC1 is linked to the General Motors Technical Center, and the letter/number combination following it is unique to each employee or engineer. Kristen Zimmerman is the person who had the email address of “LNUSTC1.VZZ559@gmeds.com”.
1st – Thank you for this Richard. This is why I give you money. 2nd- “It was a hoax.” “I do not know.” “there are liars in the government, too.” When I read your article I thought “oh it was a hoax.” Then I read the documents and realized it was NOT a hoax. Look carefully at what he said. “Hoax…I do not know.” He holds clearances, someone like him can’t say publicly ET autopsys are real. “there are liars in the government, too.” He works for / has worked for the government, he is lieing. He may even be admitting he is lieing by saying that to you. He has to lie. I could be wrong! But I think I’m right!
Thanks again for releasing this content you are truely the top researcher in the field.
Yes, I have the same thoughts. I feel for Kit on this, I really do. I feel he is in a tough place and we may never get his true opinion on the matter.
Hi Richard et al, Referring to the “alien on the slab” pic. Was that style of wall telephone available in the 1940s, particularly the spiral-style plastic-covered cord on the handset? I wasn’t around then, but I recall first seeing such a cord in the late ’60s, early ’70s. The telephones of my early childhood (born ’57) in Australia all had straight, fabric-covered cords. Seems anachronistic to me.
I recall an extended discussion on exactly that matter during the 1990s, and if I am not mistaken it was revealed that such a phone (and the specific cord in fact) WAS in use within the U.S. military at the time. I admit I have not done my own fact checking on that matter but I recall the arguments going back and forth.
I know the guy that made the aliens, he lives in Brighton here in the UK. Please let me know if you would like to speak to him Richard. I’m based in London.
I do quite a bit of reading into various aspects of the UFO phenom, but don’t consider myself to be a ‘researcher.’ But having said that, I’ve spent a considerable amount of time, today, reviewing the controversy behind the alien autopsy film, and I have to say, I believe it to be a hoax, based on what I’ve read thus far. I started out over at the UFO Watchdog website, then went from there.
I then found this:
There is quite a bit of reading to be done on this, but from what I’ve read, this does appear to have been nothing more than a hoax. I would urge all those interested in this story, to have a look/read.
Hi Kim, quite possibly that’s the case. I’m not taking a final position on this, but I am interested in why Dr. Kit Green wrote (in 2001) that he was briefed on alien bodies/autopsies at the Pentagon in 1987/88, and was shown an image of a being that was identical to the Santilli being. People like UFO Watchdog are likely missing the point. Something odd exists concerning all that, and I don’t hear very much curiosity coming from what really appears to be a group of people trying to shut all discussion of this matter down.
I didn’t really glean most of my info. from the UFO Watchdog website; most of what I’ve read thus far has come from the Openminds.TV site. It does seem as though Philip Mantle has done quite a bit of research into this issue, at least from what I’ve gleaned thus far. I’ve never heard of Mantle until I started doing a bit of reading on this case, as of yesterday. Decided to check Mantle out a bit today and I have to say, he seems like a very articulate and frankly, nice guy.
I’ve pretty much landed on ‘it’s a hoax’ at this time, but don’t really have a dog in this race at all and should anything new come about shedding new light on this issue, I’d be open to changing my mind. I think Mantle has done a very thorough job with his research into the autopsy film (more so than anyone else from what I can tell), so who knows.